Bitcoin goes up, must come down; Facebook privacy payouts; Zuck wants to inflict pain on Apple; Oculus problems; Spotify unrolls Work From Anywhere program; AI can manipulate human behavior; Russia dealing with TikTok politics; Chappelle gets paid; Whedon cancelled twice; the Stand falls on landing; Discovery Plus shows; web sleuths at the Cecil Hotel; Kim’s Convenience; iPad Life; Clubhouse facts & privacy; signs of intelligent life with Avi Loeb; supply-chain attacks; Bloomberg doubles down; Axel F; Intel mocks Apple; feedback.

This episode is brought to you by Hover. For 10% off your first order head over to and get your domain on!

Show Notes


Hacked Florida water plant used shared passwords and Windows 7 PCs

Parler is back online after Amazon kicked it off the internet


Bitcoin Trades Above $50,000 for First Time

Facebook Investor Probing $5 Billion Privacy Payout Gets a Boost

Zuckerberg reportedly said Facebook needs ‘to inflict pain’ on Apple

After the failure of the Facebook Phone, get ready for a Facebook Watch

Spotify will let employees work from almost anywhere

AI Can Now Learn to Manipulate Human Behavior

TikTok emerges as a political battleground in Navalny-stirred Russia

Minneapolis bans its police department from using facial recognition software


Chappelle’s Show returns to Netflix now that Dave got paid

Buffy Deserves Better Than Joss Whedon

First Apple TV+ AR app launches with ‘For All Mankind’ backstory through mixed reality

Review: The Stand starts out strong and then whiffs the landing

Undercover Billionaire Season 2

Undercover Billionaire: Comeback City

Crime Scene: the Vanishing at the Cecil Hotel

Kim’s Convenience


Notes Plus

Paperlike Screen Protector

Sony MDR7506 Professional Large Diaphragm Headphone

Factually: What will fact-checkers find on Clubhouse?

You’ve been invited to Clubhouse. Your privacy hasn’t.

You really shouldn’t record Clubhouse calls

How the Covid-19 pandemic broke Nextdoor


Extraterrestrial: The First Sign of Intelligent Life Beyond Earth by Avi Loeb

Follow Your Different 202 – Harvard’s Top Astronomer Says Aliens Tried to Contact Us | Dr. Avi Loeb, Author, Extraterrestrial: The First Sign of Intelligent Life Beyond Earth

Replay by Ken Grimwood


The CyberWire

Dave Bittner

Hacking Humans


Microsoft: SolarWinds attack took more than 1,000 engineers to create

New type of supply-chain attack hit Apple, Microsoft and 33 other companies

The Long Hack: How China Exploited a U.S. Tech Supplier

Bloomberg resurrects Super Micro spy chip story; NSA still ‘befuddled’ by the claims

Chrome for iOS will soon keep incognito tabs even more secret with Face ID

Is This Beverly Hills Cop Playing Sublime’s ‘Santeria’ to Avoid Being Live-Streamed?


Intel mocks Apple in new campaign highlighting things users can’t do on a M1 Mac

There’s a Crowdfunding Campaign to Send a Flat-Earther to Space


The new media mogul: Andreessen Horowitz

Flying taxis to hit the skies in 2024

AT&T scrambles to install fiber for 90-year-old after his viral WSJ ad

Stolen Tesla totaled in downtown B’ham during high-speed joy ride

“Modern” Red Envelopes – WeChat Hongbao & Demo – 微信红包

Chinese New Year greetings to impress your relatives

Covid maths: All the virus in the world would fit in a soft drink can

Grant Thornton has resigned as auditors to firms owned by operator of Pornhub

Partition 36 – The Optic Nerve

it’s not child pornography, it’s child sexual abuse material


Mixing console pioneer Rupert Neve dies at 94


Robert Fogarty 0:02
Grumpy Old Geeks a weekly talk show hosted by Brian Schulmeister and Jason DeFillippo. Discussing the finer points of what went wrong on the internet. And who's to blame.

Jason DeFillippo 0:16
Welcome to grumpy old geeks. I'm Jason DeFillippo.

Brian Schulmeister 0:19
And Brian Schulmeister. Exciting stuff.

Jason DeFillippo 0:22
Exciting. What do we got today? Brian?

Brian Schulmeister 0:24
Oh, got a bit of follow up. On surprisingly, the hacked Florida Water plant didn't apparently need to genius to do it. Windows seven PCs still in use shared passwords across the board. They might as well just had a post it note up on the monitor saying password is 12345. Yeah, and they use the remote access program TeamViewer. So while they weren't able to actually do anything, this is not exactly a good situation. This is what we've been talking about desperate need for infrastructure improvements. This is our shared water supply for Christ's sake. Windows seven has been on the outs even longer than Adobe Flash. I don't know why anybody's still using it. They don't even release security updates anymore. But yeah, the cost of doing business involves actually updating some stuff, but nobody wants to do that.

Jason DeFillippo 1:09
Oh, no, no, no, not in the budget. Brian, not in the budget. Let's try again. Next fiscal quarter is speaking

Brian Schulmeister 1:15
of not in the budget parlor is back online after Amazon. Get off the internet. This is the second story that tells us that they're back online without them actually really being back online. Okay, yeah. So in a press release and shared with Engadget and several other publications, the company said it has a new back end that is built on sustainable independent technology and not reliant on so called air quotes. Big tech for its operations. Basically mean it doesn't operate. Yeah. So before when they came back online, and it was basically just a landing page saying, Hey, we're coming back. Yeah, now that they are there, some more links and stuff. But features like account creation aren't functional yet. You can also see links to download the mobile app, but tapping those do nothing, as neither Apple or Google have allowed the company back on their respective app stores. So it's kind of back. Not really,

Jason DeFillippo 2:07
not really, can you log in at least or no? Well,

Brian Schulmeister 2:10
I didn't. I don't even want to visit the site.

Jason DeFillippo 2:13
Okay. Don't want that. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Keep that out of your history. Yeah. Well, I got an email from kwibi this morning. And I was like, wait, wait, what

Brian Schulmeister 2:26
was it a very short email.

Jason DeFillippo 2:28
It was it says hello. kwibi has recently become part of Roku. As a result, your account information will now be governed by the Roku privacy policy. Please familiarize yourself with the new terms. Thank you. Oh, no, here's, here's the part that gets me on this. Hey, it's funny to get an email from quibi. I'm like, oh, blast from the past. And also, it's like, okay, so you can sell my information to another company and force me to use their their privacy policies and their terms of use, but I don't get a say in it before you implement it. That's nice. Thanks.

Brian Schulmeister 3:01
Well, things are very not the way that we would build things. And I have a feeling that might be a recurring theme in this particular episode, because obviously, should you and I have done this, we would have included the and you can click here to opt out.

Jason DeFillippo 3:14
Or you can click here to opt in.

Brian Schulmeister 3:16
Yes. Yeah, that would be i'll come on

Jason DeFillippo 3:19
even better.

Brian Schulmeister 3:21
I'm not going for pie in the sky here. Jason. I'm just going for least common possible thing that could have done

Jason DeFillippo 3:28
not trying to boil that ocean. No.

Brian Schulmeister 3:30
And speaking of that shit, and set visibility to zero. I know you're not a huge Facebook user, but they have made some changes to their desktop version. Now, I don't know how this works on mobile. But if you try to delete a post now on Facebook, you don't just delete it like you used to. You move it to the trash where the items are deleted after 30 days.

Jason DeFillippo 3:51
Oh, lovely.

Brian Schulmeister 3:52
Low, they make it even more difficult. It's not a one click thing to delete something now you have to click through a couple things. Or they you know what they did?

Jason DeFillippo 3:59
Yeah, you know what they did there? They took a they took a hint from the account retention department. Yes. It said, you know, oh, you can delete your account. We're gonna leave it in limbo for you. It's not going to delete right away. We know you can come back anytime in the next 30 days and just log back in and your account will be resuscitated and brought back to life. Then they're like, yeah, 30 days. That seems kind of short. What if they change their mind on day 31? Well, you know what, 31 days is too long or too short. too short. Yeah, let's just make it 90 days. Yeah, so that's what it is, I believe now is 90 days before your account is actually deleted from Facebook. You can't goose the process nothing like that. Yeah, I got some I got some I got some choice words to say about Facebook later on. But

Brian Schulmeister 4:45
well, I still have some more to say about Facebook here right now. So even though they may let me keep a post that I have decided to delete for 30 days, so on day 29 I could go back in and repost that post. Nobody would fucking see it anyways because I While we're still talking about Facebook, I have a theory that I am now in algorithm jail. And I'm kind of over Facebook at this point, all my old reasons for wanting to be on Facebook, the the contact with friends that I don't live near, or frankly, just contact with friends, because it's been a year that I can't be near anybody, even if they live down the fucking street for me, all of that stuff, Facebook has completely killed them. I used to post and a whole bunch of friends would see my posts and like them and comment on them. And conversations would start and all that sort of thing, at least for the last three to four months. Anytime I post now it's fucking crickets. It's like the same three to four people that see my post. And that's it. And I'm convinced that I've gotten into algorithm jail because I used to post constantly, I was always on Facebook, I was a Facebook power user. Throughout the pandemic, I have slowed my roll considerably on Facebook, I don't post anywhere near as much anymore. And now I'm convinced because I do that. I've been kicked down the algorithm and barely anybody sees my posts anymore.

Jason DeFillippo 6:00
You'd think it would be backwards, you'd think, yeah, that common sense would dictate that they would want you to have more engagement with your friends, which would then in turn make you post more. Yeah, that's common sense. But this is

Brian Schulmeister 6:11
Facebook and it's the internet. So yeah, I'm almost positive that this is what's happened to me and now like it's a it's an inverse feedback loop. Before I had the regular feedback loop. I posted people interacted made me want to post more. Now I post a fucking tumbleweed blows by and I'm just like, Why the fuck am I on this thing?

Jason DeFillippo 6:32
Yeah, hey, I asked you that for years. Why the fuck you

Brian Schulmeister 6:35
on that? Yeah, so I'm working my way out the door slowly. I do want to end with a little bit of a positive note here in the feedback section. My mom got our second Medina shot yesterday. What a goddamn relief.

Jason DeFillippo 6:47
Excellent Excellent.

Brian Schulmeister 6:48
Good news.

Unknown Speaker 6:51
In the news

Jason DeFillippo 6:57
well Brian Giuseppe bbbbbb breaking news Yes, Bitcoin now trades above $50,000 for the first time. They did what I was looking at this it had already dropped below $50,000 Yes, well,

Brian Schulmeister 7:09
you know what I did this morning. I sold my Bitcoin.

Jason DeFillippo 7:11
Excellent. Thank

Brian Schulmeister 7:12
you. I doubled my money in Bitcoin and I'm out. That's good enough for me.

Jason DeFillippo 7:17
Okay, what's the final tally? Because you had aetherium and didn't you have something else?

Brian Schulmeister 7:20
Ethereum and Litecoin I ended up losing money on Litecoin I think I basically broke even on aetherium I ended up let's see, I initially put $20 in each so 20 2020 and then put another $200 into bitcoin about a month back or something like that. So I had $260 total in there. I ended up cashing out at 550

Jason DeFillippo 7:43
not bad not bad, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Good for you. A lot of people are not gonna have that experience.

Brian Schulmeister 7:49
Well, let me tell you about my GameStop stock No.

Jason DeFillippo 7:53
That shit yeah, this is this is getting ridiculous. This is getting ridiculous. Everybody that's jumping on board with us even financial institutions like MasterCard and the Bank of New York and all of these people are going to say hey, the bitcoins okay because everybody's using it. No,

Brian Schulmeister 8:11
this is Mark my words this will not end well. This is going to end horribly there. We will be talking about the great Bitcoin crash in within at least three months.

Jason DeFillippo 8:20
Yeah, well yeah, yeah. Cute. Like start the timer start the timer. Because this is you know, when we started this show, Brian, you were missing regulation regulation. I'm like, Oh, come on. Give it a break. lib tard snowflake mofo and now I'm like, you're taking

Brian Schulmeister 8:36
I guess you want to regulate like cyber currency.

Jason DeFillippo 8:39
Exactly. This this is this is just a bad situation getting ready to get worse. I mean, if you think that I mean, come on. Ilan can make a tweet, and completely change the face of a currency. That's not good.

Brian Schulmeister 8:55
That's not good. He's not allowed to do that for his stock. Why should he be able to do it for a currency

Jason DeFillippo 9:01
because it's unregulated his that's why and yeah, and the other thing about Bitcoin that drives me crazy is this comes up every now and again but it should be front and center about how goddamn horrible it is for the planet.

Brian Schulmeister 9:17
Yes, it is. It is the it's absolutely horrific for the planet the amount of of energy being used to for Bitcoin right now is but then again, climate change deniers whatever.

Jason DeFillippo 9:29
Yeah. And just look at also the E waste. I saw another article this week where they said that the E waste from Bitcoin miners who throw out all their old gear to buy new gear, which Why are you throwing it out donated to a school, you fucking savages equals the waste produced by the entirety of Luxembourg in a year. That's great. Yeah, I mean, I know Luxembourg isn't that big, but it's just a beautiful place and I highly recommend everybody visit it. It's one of my favorite places on the planet, but it might be now filled up with Bitcoin machine. But yeah, this is not going to end well and it's really starting to irk me, among many things, but Oh, ah, now let's go back to some Facebook news here. Facebook investors are trying to figure out if there's some shenanigans going on in the boardroom here. Yes. Interesting. Yep. Yeah, they're absolutely okay. Didn't need Betteridge on that one. All right. This is the anti better edge. A Delaware judge ruled on Wednesday that Facebook must furnish some internal files to Rhode Island's public employee pension fund, which is questioning how the company came to terms with the US FTC. In the agency's sweeping investigation of the misuse of consumer data. This comes back to Cambridge Analytica. Yep, they got dinged for $5 billion. Well, turns out 2 billion of that might have been a little greasing of the wheels, let's say to the FTC, to keep Zuckerberg out of this personally. So there was no personal liability for the huckster right, and they're saying Did you guys overpay out of our money $2 billion, just so this little prick doesn't get you know, the the government colonoscopy that he'd really like, full and truly and well deserves right along with you know, Sheryl Sandberg too, but yeah, so I am I am on, I'm on pins and needles to see how this comes out because you know, that they tacked on some extra cash to keep the Zuck safe.

Brian Schulmeister 11:27
Well, of course they did because like, let's face it, Zuckerberg is an intimidating man with his rippling muscles underneath those underneath those hoodies, because here's the other report, and I just love this one. Zuckerberg has reportedly said Facebook needs to inflict pain on Yes, because luck is the big man now. Yeah, he's pissed off at Apple. Now as we've been talking about in the show the war is brewing between the two. I can't see Facebook winning because Facebook is nothing and Apple actually makes things that everybody uses but okay. But yeah, he's really going after them now apparently he's he's amped up he's he's doing that m&m thing in the mirror in the morning when his hoodie and his fucking taking them down.

Jason DeFillippo 12:11
This is funny because here's the problem that Facebook is having. And this goes directly into the next story I have here which is Facebook is going to try and make a watch next because they failed. So you know spectacularly with their phone. It's

Brian Schulmeister 12:24
not not just their phone, they failed with their lady in the tube, that thing ain't doing well either. Nobody wants

Jason DeFillippo 12:29
the portal sold out at complete,

Brian Schulmeister 12:32
single person that has one. So if they sold out, they had a very limited supply.

Jason DeFillippo 12:36
As you say, they only made seven. But everybody that I saw that reviewed, it says one of the best video conferencing platforms out there. The problem is that nobody trusts Yeah, nobody trusts it. So now that they know I love this, this comes from Ars Technica, which came from another source because that's the way it works, but the other source was behind the paywall. So I'm going with Ars Technica today, Facebook is building an Android smartwatch and it should hit the market next year. And I love this little little buried in here is a nice little dig will the project be successful? Let's just say that every word in the phrase Facebook Android smartwatch is cause for concern. But this comes back to Facebook not owning any platforms like distribution platforms, they have a website, and they have API's. And they have apps that go on other people's, you know, actual distribution platforms, the phones and all that good stuff. But they don't actually they're beholden to Google and Apple for their mobile, you know, complete experience, which, for the most part, they're screwed if anybody decides to just go delete. Yeah, which is what's happening right now with the whole kerfuffle with Apple because Apple saying, you guys are collecting way too much data and we just want to tell everybody what you're doing, and we're gonna make it really hard for you to do that in the future. That's what it comes down to. Yep. And fucking Oculus, the motherfucking Oculus after Facebook said, you have to merge your Oculus account with a Facebook account. Well, it is now been two months. Since all of the the purchases that I had on the Oculus have completely disappeared. I am over 150 emails into Facebook right now. I have gotten one reply that said, Hey, we got this. We're sorry that you're doing wrong here. Well, what's what's actually is your problem. So I sent the back the thing crickets. So now like three or four times a day, I just email them and say hello, anybody fucking home.

Brian Schulmeister 14:33
And you know what you need to do. Jason, it's time for the public shaming. It's time to take this private conversation public on Twitter, because that's the only way you're gonna get a result.

Jason DeFillippo 14:42
Yeah, that's it. I actually did go to the Oculus forum and posted something there yesterday and say, Hey, who else is this happened to because maybe we can start a class action lawsuit because I'm sure I can't be the only one that you know is having this issue. But it was Presidents Day yesterday, right, which usually means nothing for customer support anymore because none of it's in America. But I'm going to give them to the end of the day to see what's going on. And I just I don't know what to do anymore. I don't know what to do anymore.

Brian Schulmeister 15:07
Yep, they've let you. They've left you hanging.

Jason DeFillippo 15:09
No, they they they sold me a very pretty paperweight that I would have to rebuy all of my content on which I spent, like over 150 bucks and content, right? I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna give them an extra 150 bucks for fucking me. Give them money for the privilege of fucking me. No, thank you

Brian Schulmeister 15:25
gotta have that side hustle, I suppose? Yeah, yes, yes, yes. Speaking of that, work from home, we've got some work from home news, Spotify has come out and said, fuck it, you don't have to come back. Okay. But they've announced their work from anywhere program through which it will allow employees to set up shop pretty much wherever they choose, it will largely be up to employees, whether they venture to an office once and safe to do that again, or mostly just work from home, or from anywhere with a decent internet connection. If they choose a location where there's no Spotify office close by the company will set them up with the CO working space membership. Hence the information about we work surviving this in the last show. Yeah, so they're calling the move. A new way of collaborating allows Spotify buyers to work from wherever, for wherever, wherever they do their best thinking and creating. Now this all sounds wonderful, and it sounds like it's across the board and it's going to be a few a complete shift in the way that people move and work moving forward where they're going to go all that sort of stuff. There will be a few limits on location however based around timezone requirements and regional entity laws. Also, I got into this a little bit because I happen to know a few people that work over at Spotify. Basically the higher up the chain You are the closer you need to be to a fucking office so so if you are one of the people that is going through, say playlists and all of that, by all means sit on a beach in Aruba. If you happen to be a lawyer for Spotify, you're staying fucking where the office is.

Jason DeFillippo 16:55
Exactly. Yeah, how that works. Oh, man, it's what it's gonna it's gonna be like that after this pandemic I swear I want to go to an office now.

Brian Schulmeister 17:07
I'm not I'm so thrilled that I might be starting a real job when this is over because I am so done with work from home I did it for 20 years one year doing it with the entire family at home get me into a fucking office.

Jason DeFillippo 17:19
I know I'm like I'm scoping out co working offices right now because I think maybe you know if you time it right, you can still get a pretty good deal because they're desperate. So like lock in a good deal while the pandemic is still here. And then you know, just don't go over use somebody else. No, no, no, I'm going it's a it's a much more fancy pants place. Huh Calabasas? Yes. Kardashians have been seen there's

Brian Schulmeister 17:44
got to be more you're gonna be in a cubicle right next to Kim Kardashian is shooting her webshots

Jason DeFillippo 17:50
Oh, actually, Jaden Jaden Smith shoots her show from that. So I'm hoping maybe just to get some business out of it. But yeah, I'm trying to get since the Kardashians do show up. I'm trying to get a little bit more knocked off their rent, cuz I'm like, that's not a perk. That is not a perk.

Brian Schulmeister 18:10

Jason DeFillippo 18:11
No, seriously, if he's gonna be swinging by I want another 15% off. On and off now. And I saw this one over in science alert thought it was pretty funny. AI can now learn to manipulate human behavior. Uh huh. Uh huh. Yeah, yeah. They're saying now that they can. They did a bunch of different experiments three to be precise. And over the course of the experiments, they figured out how to juice the results to get people to pick things that they normally wouldn't have picked from the the control rounds. Right. Okay. Why did you make this? Why

Brian Schulmeister 18:50
did we need machine learning to figure out how to influence us? Did you not see the last election cycle?

Jason DeFillippo 18:57
We're pretty good at this already. Stop taking the jobs man. I'm taking the jobs. Oh, cozy bear and fancy bear gonna be definitely out first. Speaking of Tag, you're it Russia. Tick Tock is now turned into basically how all the elda kids are organizing over in Russia for their big protests. So I'm like what's good for the goose is good for the gander. You're turned. Yep, it is your turn. fuckers. And we got one more. We got one more city. Minneapolis has banned its Police Department from using facial recognition and that includes the douchebags at Clearview AI.

Brian Schulmeister 19:34
Well, that's good news.

Jason DeFillippo 19:36
Yep, yep. We only got like point 00 1% of the police officers or police departments around the country. So it's a long road but we'll get there eventually.

Unknown Speaker 19:58
Media Academy

Jason DeFillippo 20:01
In a surprising bit of news, Dave Chappelle got his show back and got paid. Can you believe that Comedy Central actually did the right thing?

Brian Schulmeister 20:11
I'm shocked. I'm surprised Comedy Central has any money.

Jason DeFillippo 20:14
That's true, too. Well, it's it's, you know, Viacom Oh wait, I'm surprised they have any money to they gave him a couple million bucks and gave him his name back. So all's well that ends well,

Brian Schulmeister 20:24
that's. That's surprising. Good news. Yeah,

Jason DeFillippo 20:27
unless you're just Sweden, then that's not ending well at all. Now, everybody on the Buffy cast has come out and you know, canceled him. But here's the funny thing. I thought he was already cancelled. So he's getting double cancel. Can you get canceled twice?

Brian Schulmeister 20:40
I don't know. I guess so. I suppose. This is this has been very sad news for for my wife. She is of the perfect age so her and her friends have been commiserating. First we first we lost Harry Potter and now we're losing Buffy. But you don't lose the shows just the creator's Well,

Jason DeFillippo 20:55
you always say Brian, you can separate the creator from the art

Brian Schulmeister 20:58
sometimes not so much with Michael Jackson.

Jason DeFillippo 21:00
Okay, okay. Well, you gotta you gotta clarify these rules sometimes. Yes,

Brian Schulmeister 21:05
complicated. I might need AI to figure this out.

Jason DeFillippo 21:08
I think so. Because Yeah, you've made some questionable decisions with that statement in the past so well.

Brian Schulmeister 21:17
I don't care. I've never really watched Buffy anyways, so for me, this is no big of a deal. But yeah, I don't know what it was. There's so much canceling going on right now. It's a little crazy. I'll get into that later when I talk about something. So.

Jason DeFillippo 21:30
Okay, we're gonna talk about something. I still love Buffy. So I'm still gonna watch it. You know, and I come from the era where Yes, I know, everybody that works in Hollywood is a fucking raging asshole. And so I I used to work at Hollywood. I know that we get treated like crap, you get your job done. That's

Brian Schulmeister 21:46
what happens. Yeah, that's the job.

Jason DeFillippo 21:49
Yeah, no snowflakes in Hollywood. Also in Hollywood, now we're getting AR with for all mankind. This is the Ronald D. Moore Show, which neither of us

Brian Schulmeister 22:00
will watch. I tried. And, you know, I'd rather they spent the money on better writing than a little, you know, thing like this, personally, okay.

Jason DeFillippo 22:09
Yeah, this AR thing actually sounds much more interesting than the show itself. But the problem is you need one of the LIDAR enabled devices from Apple, which I do not have me either. So now there was apparently a desktop version that you could check out and I'm like, what's the point of that? That's no fun. So and I saw this over at Ars Technica, and I thought we should just wrap up here and this is a review of the standard says it starts out strong and then with the landing.

Brian Schulmeister 22:32
Yeah. I watched the I watched the last episode last night, which means I can finally cancel CBS all access until they're not some Star Trek. They did with landing. I don't understand why they spent the entire last episode focusing on was basically a coda and only the extended version of the book. But they did and it was like the weakest part of everything. So way two, way to end. Great job.

Jason DeFillippo 22:56
Yep. Bravo. So you're getting rid of CBS all access, which will soon be paramount plus, yes. So when you come back, you'll be coming back to a new service. I have been on Discovery plus rights quite a bit recently. And when I popped on undercover billionaire was a show I really liked. Glenn Stern's billionaire dude went undercover and in 90 day hit 90 days $100 in a pickup truck to build a million dollar business. I won't spoil the first episode or first season, but he's back with the second season with 3 billion or three. I'm not billionaires rich people. This time. It's Timberlands wife, Grant, Cardone. douchebag right. And some real estate chick from Fallbrook, California. Grant Cardone is the biggest whiner on the planet, Mr. Big muscley bound guy. Just like, Oh, I'm having such a hard time. This is so bad. And the chicks are out there just killing it. It's so much fun. It's only halfway through the run. And it seems like they're releasing them every two weeks or so. Which is interesting. But they're coming out faster on Discovery plus, which is a surprise, which is why I wanted to bring it up because what you said about discovery plus is there's like none of the new shows. Yeah, period. Right. And I found that in the Food Network for sure. I'm like,

Brian Schulmeister 24:12
Yes. What the fuck? Yeah, fuck, they are pushing some things and some things are exclusives only to get you over there but in terms of like their bread and butter food. Yeah, it's a all their all their long standing shows. They're not bothering to fill those in with with recent recent stuff. So that sucks. So if you want if you're lured in to discovery plus by some of their newer shows, like jyada, and what's his face, go to go to Italy? That's great. But if you're paying for discovery, plus to get access to all the shows that you know and love from broadcast, you're fucked.

Jason DeFillippo 24:48
Well, that's funny. That's the actual show that I signed up for to watch right. I still haven't watched it yet. Here's the great part that with the Food Network stuff. I never watched the Food Network. So everything is new to you. Yeah, it's all new to me. It's great. Yeah. So I have 1000s of hours of crap to watch when things are not going well. So I suppose the undercover billionaire season two is out right now halfway through it. And there was another one I found called undercover billionaire comeback city, which also is only six episodes. But pretty fun. Yeah, I enjoyed that series. For some reason. I don't know, why

Brian Schulmeister 25:18
don't I do? That's fair. Look, all I want from discovery plus is some clarification of what their policy is. I know, I've tweeted them. I saw that you tweeted them. Yes. Some of our other listeners have also tweeted them, because obviously, people have discovered that, you know, a lot of shows are not up to date. What's going on? Can you tell us what's happening? Nobody has responded, because I don't think there is a policy. I think it's just a big old mess over there.

Jason DeFillippo 25:41
Yeah, too. It's a I'm sure the lawyers have the problem. Yeah, you know, and here's, here's one other thing that I use the Roku app, to watch it, there is a glitch. And I think it has to be in the Roku app, but it might be on other platforms. So if you're listening to this, and you have discovery, plus, if you pause the show, hit play, then anywhere between 30 seconds and two minutes in, it'll stop and it'll like just chunk for about five seconds and then come back. No buffering screen and nothing It will just lock for five seconds and then come back interest if Tell me if anybody's listening that has has the Roku app if you have this problem too. Because it's now that we know what it is. It's okay we expect it but man it was maddening when we first started watching like what the fuck is wrong with this thing? Come on.

Brian Schulmeister 26:28
Alright, so I watched something sort of now this is this is my wife's thing and I initially was just curled up on the couch with my book and I wasn't going to pay attention to it but I slowly got sucked in. Not for the reason you'd think this is crime scene the vanishing at the Cecil Hotel over on Netflix. I don't know if you remember this. This is when the girl Elisa Lam Chinese Canadian came to LA to visit stayed at a really shitty hotel downtown. That's like infamous I mean, the the the hillside strangler guys stay there, all that sort of stuff. are sorry, the nightstalker that guy, really bad hotel like you should not be there. But you get to get into it. They tried to spruce it up. They made like a little hostile thing that was three floors while the crazy people stayed on the other floors. This is a girl very hostile, hostile. It was this is the girl that vanished and then they found her in the water tank and then people had been drinking the water for like weeks, all that sort of stuff here. But do you remember that it was omitted maybe you should watch this but Okay, so she disappeared and they've never really figured out what happened except for the fact that they once they started to get into it, they found out she was kind of manic depressive. There's this creepy elevator footage of her that that is totally like one of the first things that really went viral on the internet in terms of like true crime and all that sort of stuff. You can tell she just lost it basically she wasn't on her meds and she probably just did this herself button. And this is why I got sucked in what they call the internet sleuth community.

Jason DeFillippo 27:56
No god

Brian Schulmeister 27:57
yes, this entire documentary is about web sluice really is about no morons with YouTube channels and podcasts that cannot let anything go that think that they are smarter than police that think that they can figure things out better than police that then start to go to the hotel. These people are fucking nuts. And this ties directly into canceled culture because this is there are so many people out there was so much free time that don't know what the fuck that they're doing. And they should not have internet connections. I I didn't want to watch this at all. My wife was watching it for the actual like she was hoping to, you know, get a really good like True Crime documentary type thing. We both started just getting fascinated. And our jaws were dropping because the entire thing is interviews with these webs loose and these people are fucking nuts. They're crazy. And there's tons of them.

Jason DeFillippo 28:53
Oh, yeah, there was another series that I reviewed a while ago. Maybe it's part of this series. It was about this guy that like killed some cats. And then the internet sleuths got on top of it to try and track them down. Yeah. And I'm pretty sure that they aren't the ones that are pretty sure that they weren't the ones that cracked the nut. But my friend Steve Isaacs, he's an old MTV vj, he he made a tweet that I thought was perfect. He's like, Netflix has a huge catalogue of amazing true crime that you can watch for hours on end. The Vanishing at the Cecil Hotel is not one of

Brian Schulmeister 29:28
them. Yeah, it was it was it was just shocking to me. And I felt dirty afterwards. And it had nothing to do with the actual crime. It's just had to do with these fucking crazy people. Also, it's not a very well done documentary because it tries to lure you in on what it's supposed to be about. But they have no information. They don't know shit, except for what is kind of obvious. And you know, oxygen's razor here, people, we know what kind of happened to her, but not for these fucking people. And somehow they've managed four episodes, just interviewing these nut bags and it's not insane. So

Jason DeFillippo 30:01
here's the here's the difference, Brian, they're on Netflix and we're not maybe we should try.

Brian Schulmeister 30:06
Yeah, and the thing is, this whole thing was produced by Brian, Brian Glazer and Ron Howard and I will be so embarrassed to have my name on this.

Jason DeFillippo 30:15
Man must be uh, you know what? COVID times they go over times, I

Brian Schulmeister 30:19
guess so. Wow. And then to kind of cleanse ourselves after watching those. This show has been around for a long time. We've never watched it. It is produced in Toronto, Canada. And it's so again, this is a big on my wife's to watch list. But I have to say, utterly delightful. There's a show called Kim's convenience. It is one of the best comedies I've seen. It's four seasons in it's fucking hilarious. And I mean, you want to talk canceled culture. They don't give a shit. Like the first episode isn't is just insanely like the racist jokes. The homophobic jokes. They fly left, right and center. It is fucking hilarious. It's so good.

Jason DeFillippo 30:57
See, racism and homophobia are funny.

Brian Schulmeister 31:00
Yes, they can be.

Jason DeFillippo 31:02
How old is this series?

Brian Schulmeister 31:03
Oh, not that old. They're still producing it. So I think the fifth season is coming soon. So I highly recommend it, man. It's very funny. Okay,

Jason DeFillippo 31:10
yeah, I need some non snowflake comedy. I'm in. I'm in

Unknown Speaker 31:16
ups and Duda.

Jason DeFillippo 31:19
So I've been rewiring my studio here. And I've been having these power issues and like, you know, little clicks and pops in the audio and lights flickering, and stuff like that. I'm like, I figured all the power from the house because I'm in a garage. It's just crappy. And then one day I'm moving stuff around. And I noticed that I cuz I have, like, you know, General power strips around here with a bunch of stuff plugged into them. You know, the cheap and cheerful ones will pick up everywhere. Yeah. Oh, these are monsters. These were monster power strips. But I noticed that one of them had fused to the actual extension cord that it was plugged into because I had overloaded. So I went out and I bought actual really nice monster power strips the like 2000 jewels, which make your own Pulp Fiction Joke's on that one. But I plug those things in not a problem anymore. It's perfect. I can even run my space heater, and all of my lights and everything and not a single problem. So if you have weird issues in your house, and you've been using these cheap as power strips forever, it might be worth upgrading those as all I'm saying.

Brian Schulmeister 32:26
Yep, keep the power clean.

Jason DeFillippo 32:28
Yeah, definitely. And this week, I have done almost entirely the show notes that I put into this episode on my iPad. I have gotten I you know, I got the 12 inch iPad Pro. I could never get the damn multitasking to work right. So I spent five minutes and figured out how to do it. So now I've got a split screen with reader on the hat on one half and the quip app that we use not quip the toothbrush but we use quip the collaborative editing software from Salesforce to do the show notes for this. And it's great. I can just sit there in the backyard and just scroll through stories, copy, paste, move them around. The entirety now is just done on the iPad. It's awesome. I highly recommend it. I know I'm late to the show on this one. But I was like once I got it once I got it cookin man. It's like, wow, multitasking is neat. Neat, very neat. So his notes plus, I've been taking a lot of notes because I've got a lot of scripts that I have to write. And I like to write them in longhand. And most of the note taking apps do have like handwriting recognition, but getting them to export into plain text is like a Herculean effort, right? notes plus, lets you like dump an entire notebook as plain text. So you can just go to your heart's content, and then just dump the whole thing, bring it into a text editor later, and then you know, put it back together so it's coherent. Right. And the handwriting recognition is phenomenal. I mean, I got terrible handwriting. It is like 99% on on picking up everything I do, and it's only 10 bucks. works great on the iPad Pro with the pencil and I use that. Remember I told you about that screen protector I got that's like I think it's paper like yeah, was the name of it. Oh man, it's so nice. If you're using a pencil and writing on it, it really does feel like paper is really cool. I highly recommend

Brian Schulmeister 34:22
it. All of those. Alright, since we've gotten our audio situation so dialed in here I've been using my Sennheiser headphones forever. And our sound and I was so good. You were hearing yourself bleed through constantly. So I got the Sony MDR 7506 professional large diaphragm headphones at your recommendation with nice big ear cuppies and you can't hear me any. You can't hear yourself anymore. So probably my fault. Now they're nowhere near as uncomfortable as my sennheisers. And they certainly music doesn't sound as good, but for this particular application. There you go.

Jason DeFillippo 34:54
Yep, you find these in every radio station on the planet for a reason. They're there you know neutral response. They do fit they they you know that you'll break them in those cups will break in over like you know, a couple weeks and they'll be fine. They get they get comfy or like an old pair of tennis shoes. Now let's move on to clubhouse. Oh yeah, clubhouse? Yeah, I found this one And it's called factually, what will fact checkers find on clubhouse? Well, turns out that most of the article is not a lot, because there are so many issues with the fact that you can't go back to listen to any conversations, you have to listen in real time and take notes because you quote unquote, can't record the conversations I have. I have a video PSA coming out about that very shortly that you can see, it is so easy to record the conversations, you just can't do it in the app, it costs you about a $3 for a cable, and anybody that's recorded the radio can do, as I said, in the Warner Brothers music, big conference room to the head of Warner Brothers music some

Brian Schulmeister 35:53
25 odd years ago, anything that's digital can be recorded. If you can hear it, you can see it, you can record it. Yes, period.

Jason DeFillippo 36:02
But yeah, we'll talk about that. But it's an interesting, it's an interesting take on fact checkers. And the thing about this article, if you go and check it out, there is a series that they do that fact checkers actually right. And there's a whole bunch of articles about fact checking, which I thought was fascinating. I'm like, Oh, I'm not gonna read them because I don't care that much. But people who are interested in fact checking can go check out those articles. Right. So check it out.

Brian Schulmeister 36:26
Check it out. So over at Vox, they have a very long article that's titled you've been invited the clubhouse your privacy hasn't. And this details all the horrific things that they do privacy wise, which is basically everything. They suck up all your contacts if you don't let them have your contacts, but you're in somebody else's contacts your shit out of luck, because now you're in their system, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You can read all about this if you want to get into it. What drives me crazy is that, you know, okay, hold on a second. They're valued clubhouse is valued at a billion dollars right now.

Jason DeFillippo 36:59
They are a billion. Oh, God, they are valued

Brian Schulmeister 37:02
at a billion dollars right now. As you've already pointed out, the content itself is somewhat suspect. their privacy policies are somewhat suspect. As this article gets into half their site doesn't work. settings pages have serious glitches. Sometimes the link led to a redirect to a real privacy policy most of the time it didn't. This is also true for what's new fact community guidelines and Terms of Service. Imagine a world in which Jason, you and I built up a website that didn't work that links didn't work that was horrific, privacy wise, that didn't really have any content that was worth anything. Holocaust really was buzz, and you're valued at a billion dollars. That's where we're at now.

Jason DeFillippo 37:43
We did it wrong. We just did it all wrong. We did we created a good website. We did that right where it was wrong. It was just wrong. Yeah. Exactly. Wow. No, and everybody's got in for clubhouse. Now. Everybody has a knockoff coming. And it's gonna be interesting. I think clubhouse their first mover advantage isn't going to stick on this. I think they're going to get their lunch eaten. It's even Mark Cuban's in on it. So we talked about that last episode. And I don't I don't give any credence to Mark Cuban but Twitter spaces are coming out and you know, Facebook's on it. Everybody's going to be on it. Because here's the thing about clubhouse. Not that hard to do. The whole thing about it is not that hard to do. It's all turnkey shit. They're using back end from guess. Wait for China, of course. So yeah, there's a lot of tech issues here that are not hard to solve, which means they could have actually spent a little bit more time and I don't know made their four page website actually work? I don't know. Yeah. And yeah, when I was talking about the the calls on clubhouse and how you can record them there's a great article by Preston Byrne. he's a he's an attorney does mostly crypto stuff. So don't don't hold that against him. But he does a really good article called you really shouldn't record clubhouse calls. Because just because you can do something doesn't make it legal. Yeah. We've talked about this a little on the discord channel, too. Yeah. But yeah, just assume, just assume that if you're on clubhouse, you're being recorded.

Brian Schulmeister 39:14
Yes, you probably are pretty safe to say. I also found this one over at Vox how the covid 19 pandemic broke next door. Now you and I can argue till the day ends that next door was a broken pre COVID-19. As we call the app, it's the best way to find out which of your neighbors are racist. That's what yeah,

Jason DeFillippo 39:31
it's that's exactly what it is.

Brian Schulmeister 39:32
Yeah, but this article gets into that since COVID-19. A lot of people have turned to next door for local information for staying close to neighbors for figuring out what's going on in the neighborhood for talking about stuff. And basically this entire article is if you try to go on and do the right thing, you're gonna get shut down. Huh? Yeah, it's people that actually have knowledge and are doing the right thing and are trying to, you know, spread good information to keep their communities healthy and safe and being shut down by crazy anti vaxxers Knock bags that live next door.

Jason DeFillippo 40:02
Yeah fun time.

Brian Schulmeister 40:03
And this article really gets into one where basically one guy who was basic who told his neighbor to delete a post and accused the neighbor of lying because the neighbor was spreading anti Vax and crazy information. And next door shut him down. Yeah.

Jason DeFillippo 40:19
Well, I got a story about getting shut down real quick. Our friend Eric Hundley, who runs the unstructured podcast has been building up his YouTube channel, doing live streams for the past year and got up to about 15,000 subscribers, which is impressive, very impressive. Well, last weekend in the middle of a livestream with a Bitcoin professional, just it was just a q&a asking information about Bitcoin and how it works and things like that. YouTube suddenly decided to deactivate his channel midstream and shut him down and take them off the internet. They turn the sprinklers on as as we often like to say. And yeah, for basically didn't tell him anything. He's been fighting to get it back, found some secret links to get into some secret backdoor things to get it turned back on. And they finally turned it back on yesterday. Except they did not turn on seven months worth all this stuff is seven months old,

Brian Schulmeister 41:16
right or older. It's like discovery plus,

Jason DeFillippo 41:19
exactly the discovery plus is but Eric's channel. So this is a cautionary tale. But we've said it before. And I feel bad for Eric because he has put so much work into it, and doesn't make money off of it and didn't do anything wrong. You know, if he was doing something wrong, I'd been like, yeah, you know, if you're talking about how the frogs are turning gay, well, then I'd be like, shut your ass down. He was just doing a informative q&a. And some troll probably came in and reported his channel, right. And the fact that they didn't give him the option to appeal that before just taking them off the internet. You know, that's on YouTube. So if you know anybody at YouTube that can help get Eric's content back. drop me a note, JJ And I'll put you in touch because it's bullshit. And, you know, there's a lot of work that went into that and he shouldn't he doesn't deserve it.

Unknown Speaker 42:13
The library

Brian Schulmeister 42:16
I read extraterrestrial the first sign of intelligent life beyond Earth by Avi Loeb. Now Avi Loeb is a learned man, a very smart man. He is professor of science in Harvard University. He is chair of Harvard's department of astronomy. He's the founding director of Harvard's black hole initiative and director of the Institute for theory and computation within the Harvard Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics. He knows his stuff. This entire book is purportedly about the you remember that big cigar shaped maybe? thing that came through it? Yeah, 10 years ago, I can't remember what it was called. It was about a year and a half ago, a year and a half ago, whatever I don't remember. So this is supposedly just about how this is this could have been extraterrestrial life. And maybe about two paragraphs. Maybe a whole chapter was actually about that. This could have been one pager, this could have been an article on, say, the Atlantic or something like that. And said, I read an entire book about his life, which admittedly was fascinating. He certainly really loves his wife. I definitely got that from the book. I did not get much about how this could have been an intelligent life.

Jason DeFillippo 43:22
Interesting. It's funny that you read that book, because you said that there's no way you were going to read that book. Because I had told you about Avi Loeb, and you can go check out follow your different episode. 202 link for that will be in the show notes where Chris Lochhead interviews Dr. avi Loeb, well,

Brian Schulmeister 43:39
let me tell you how the hype machine works, because when lon Lochhead started posting about it, I was like shit, I guess I have to read this book. Turns out I didn't you can listen to the podcast. I should have just done that.

Jason DeFillippo 43:53
Yeah, cuz i think i think the podcast was half I think the the breakdown is about the same. Yeah, as far as obvious life and then the the Extra Terrestrial stuff, but I like it. He's a smart guy. Very nice.

Brian Schulmeister 44:06
And like I said, I I I didn't not enjoy reading the book. It's just not what was on the tin.

Jason DeFillippo 44:13
Yeah, yeah, I kinda I get that I haven't read it but I have it but now that now that I know I probably won't read it. But I gotta tell you when when we interviewed him for the show, I just go in and do sound checks but when he when he came on this guy had his background was exactly eat that title that you just all those titles that you read. Yeah. His background matched it. Like to a tee. It was like the most beautiful study with books everywhere. And I'm like, it wasn't fake. It wasn't a digital background. This was really like his study and I'm like, Damn, bro. Smart dude. knowledge he has knowledge up and now I am reading a replay by Ken Grimwood. It's a story about a guy that like the long and short of This guy is 40 he dies wakes back up in his 18 year old body with all of his knowledge something that we all would really like to have happen to I'm not gonna give any spoilers but I'm about a third of the way through and it's it's a delightful little read someone on discord recommended this

Brian Schulmeister 45:15
discord channel I thought that was interesting so cool yeah

Jason DeFillippo 45:18
so far I'm really digging it I have the full the full write up next episode

Robert Fogarty 45:26
Security hah!

Jason DeFillippo 45:30
We are joined again this week by Dave Bittner. Dave is the host of the cyber wire podcast and also the co host of the social engineering podcast hacking humans with Joe Kerrigan, as well as the co host of caveat with Ben yelin, where they discuss law and policy as well as surveillance and privacy. Welcome, Dave. Hello. Hello. Nice

Unknown Speaker 45:47
to be back.

Jason DeFillippo 45:48
Do we have any Star Wars talk this week? Brian. Anything on your mind? No, no,

Brian Schulmeister 45:53
no. Haven't been reading the comics don't know what's going on. Don't care. No,

Jason DeFillippo 45:58
no, no. Mandalorian cancel news that you want to discuss. Oh,

Brian Schulmeister 46:02
gee, what's her face? What's her name?

Jason DeFillippo 46:06
Yeah, I'm the same he will not be rehired. Yeah,

Brian Schulmeister 46:08
she will not be real. Right. Look, you know, yeah. Yep. Look that, you know, a lot of people are getting canceled. Sometimes it's a little questionable sometimes. pretty fucking obvious.

Dave Bittner 46:21
I just think about everything that she has thrown away. You know, I mean, you you get a roll. Like, I mean, maybe she can still go to conventions and sign autographs and all that sort of thing. But if you got a movie deal

Brian Schulmeister 46:35
with, with who? Yeah.

Dave Bittner 46:40
Yeah, I mean, she she was gonna have her own series. She went from having her

Brian Schulmeister 46:44
own Disney Star Wars series to doing doing a movie with what's his face? I can't even remember his name. A little annoying guy.

Jason DeFillippo 46:52

Dave Bittner 46:53
Yeah, she would have been set for life just for doing the convention circuit and all that kind of stuff. And she just couldn't couldn't help herself. I

Jason DeFillippo 47:01
guess. No,

Brian Schulmeister 47:02
do it so she ever does conventions. I might actually go to one and just like draw a little Hitler mustache on her on her promo pic and have her sign.

Dave Bittner 47:13
I don't know. You know, she, I mean, she could totally take you out Brian. She may not be a nice person, but she is still incredibly physically fit and capable. True

Brian Schulmeister 47:23
to that. I'll have a lightsaber with me and I'll have you with me behind me, Dave and your star in your in your Stormtrooper outfit.

Jason DeFillippo 47:31
But right as we know, stormtroopers can't shoot for shit. You might want you might want to find somebody else.

Brian Schulmeister 47:36
Aim at Mark Hamill. Dave, aim at Mark Hamill. Yeah,

Dave Bittner 47:39
you'll turn around and you'll say Dave, get her and you'll see this stormtroopers sprinting away in the other direction.

Jason DeFillippo 47:48
Do people not read their morality clauses anymore? I

Brian Schulmeister 47:51
was wondering about that, as well. Because I remember a couple of times in our distant past, we had signed on with various podcast networks that promised many things and delivered none of them. But the one thing that they did deliver was a gigantic morality clause.

Jason DeFillippo 48:07
We're like, have you heard our show before? They sign it but okay. Maybe she did the same thing that we did. We just pretty much ignored it.

Brian Schulmeister 48:18
I'm sure. Have you looked at my Twitter feed?

Jason DeFillippo 48:24
Yeah, there we have it. There's our Star Wars news for the week. Okay, cool. I saw this one come through. Zd net. And this actually no, this one comes from Eric Hundley, friend of the show. I got other ones that came through the others. This solar wind attack took more than 1000 engineers to create says Microsoft. That seems like a lot

Brian Schulmeister 48:45
more than word. Yeah.

Dave Bittner 48:49
We covered this today on the cyber wire. And, you know,

Jason DeFillippo 48:53
do you smell the BS on that number? Because

Dave Bittner 48:56
Microsoft says a lot of things. Our take is that what when they say 1000? what they really mean is a lot. And we're with them on that this was it was very sophisticated means more than one. Yeah. But 1000 1000 is a lot of people. So I don't know if 1000 stands up to scrutiny. But we will we're on board with the notion that it was a lot

Jason DeFillippo 49:27
more than one. Just a couple

Brian Schulmeister 49:30

Dave Bittner 49:30
And folks who knew what they were doing. I mean, you know, this is this is not skids fooling around. These folks knew what they were doing.

Jason DeFillippo 49:37
Yeah, it's not Vlad and his grandma's basement in Moscow. Right. All right. Okay. I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't a little crazy on Netflix. I'm like 1000 is kind of a lot. I mean, that's it. That's how many people it took to make Google Maps. And Google Maps, you know? Yeah.

Dave Bittner 49:55
Yeah. They think about how what it takes to organize 1000 people on any sort of development. project I mean, especially

Jason DeFillippo 50:01
in Russia. Geez. I don't know. But

Unknown Speaker 50:06
you're not telling us?

Jason DeFillippo 50:09
You have no idea. Yes, my ransomware as a service company is doing just fine. Thank you very much.

Dave Bittner 50:17
All right, comrade.

Jason DeFillippo 50:18
Yes. This other one that came in though. new site, new site a new type of supply chain attack hit Apple, Microsoft and 33 other companies. Now this one was scary for me. What they're doing is basically using open source software and kind of hijacking the public repos by putting in code that is named exactly like other code that's in the repos up upping the version number and keeping all the dependencies the same. So it looks the same, but it is not the same. And when people go to do pull requests on the packages, they're getting code that is not the actual package. Now, I always thought that there was a lot more security in place to prevent like, you know, fraud or namespace collisions, but nope. Not at all. No,

Brian Schulmeister 51:08
if only it was on the blockchain.

Jason DeFillippo 51:11
Oh, man. Yeah, this is one of the one of the downsides of open source software, if you've ever run a WordPress plug in the year, or install the WordPress plug in and had to update it, because one little library somewhere I'm looking at you, Tim thumb, will, you know, basically expose every piece of software that you've ever installed, because one person screwed up? And this is like that nobody screwed up. They did this maliciously. And it's, you know, it's, it's a bad day for open source software, I think. And for these repositories, they're really going to have to scramble to kind of have some kind of mechanisms in place to make sure that what you're getting is what you're getting. Yeah, some damn timing, you know, my feeling has always been open sources. Absolutely great. Until it's not.

Brian Schulmeister 51:57
You know what I mean? Like, it's it's a wonderful concept until all of a sudden your ass out in the wind.

Dave Bittner 52:02
Yeah. And it's worth noting that all basically all of these companies gave this researcher the maximum amount that you can get from their bug bounty programs. Yeah, some of them even more than that. If this was a big deal, a big, big, big, big deal.

Jason DeFillippo 52:22
Yep. So I'm really curious how they're going to start to mitigate this. Because, yeah, I have no idea. No idea. Yeah. Speaking of somebody that has an idea, but I think they may have no idea Bloomberg is back in the news. With their supply chain hack that we talked about, was it two years ago? 2018, I think than the first was

Dave Bittner 52:45
2019. Yep.

Jason DeFillippo 52:46
Yeah. And even back, then we're like, show your work. Show us one of these boards that has been compromised in a supply chain attack with this grain of rice chip that you keep saying exists, but have not been able to produce. And they're back again, saying the same thing. And everybody's just scratching their head going, you guys are really willing to die on this hill, aren't you?

Dave Bittner 53:08
Yeah, they're doubling down on this. And, but still no evidence? None. They've got they've got more people talking about it. They've got some folks who are on the record. But if you break it apart, if you really parse what people are saying, there's really, there's nothing new here. And folks like NSA are still saying, in response to this new article, they're saying, Nope, still nothing. We don't know what you're talking about here. You know, they talk about in the story, how this could be some bit of embedded hardware that's in one of the the internal layers of a multi layer printed circuit board. You know, we're all familiar with printed circuit boards. And I think most of us probably think about how they have circuitry on one side of the board and circuitry on the other side of the board. Well, for many, many years, there have been multi layer printed circuit boards, which have more than just the two sides, there are layers embedded sandwiched within the circuit board. And that would be a place where you could hide something

Jason DeFillippo 54:15
big mac,

Dave Bittner 54:16
with a sesame seed, but they they they allude to that in the article, but again, show me show us an X ray, show us something. There's no if they just keep saying this is a hardware based thing, and there's no evidence, there's no evidence. And you have so many other security researchers are saying why would they do this in hardware when you could achieve the same thing through software? It's just it still doesn't make sense. I don't understand the timing of it. Why? Why Bloomberg decided to double down now. You know, I know some of the people who are mentioned in the article one of them is a co worker of mine here from data tribe. And I just Don't get it. I don't get it. Well, we remain skeptical. Yeah, we remain skeptical. And until Bloomberg actually comes up with some evidence, I don't think there's much more to say about this. And what why would you? Why would you double down on this with no new evidence? That's, I just just make any sense. You guys have any thoughts on this beyond? Am I missing something here?

Jason DeFillippo 55:25
That's what I want to know. Am I missing something? Because to me, it's ridiculous. What are they? What are they at? about this? What What do they have to gain? You know, it's like, everybody forgot about the last article. It was fine. It was quiet. It had gone away. You know? It's like that time you really, really got drunk at the party. And

Brian Schulmeister 55:45
some journalists got something over one of the editors there, that's all I can.

Jason DeFillippo 55:51
Yeah, it's like, why would you say hey, look, I found these photos on the phone at that time, I really got drunk and got really stupid and puked in the in the fern. You know? Hey, let's look at them again. and post them to Instagram. Like makes no sense. Yeah, you guys got away with it? So what the hell? Yep.

Dave Bittner 56:08
Yeah. If they come up with some evidence, great. But until then there's there's no, it's up to them to make their case and it's up to the journalist to make their case and, and they have not as Super micro again, has released another statement saying there's nothing to this. We don't understand this. No one has we there's nothing here. I don't know. It's just a real head scratcher. I don't I don't get it. Yeah,

Jason DeFillippo 56:33
yeah. Okay. Well, we're all in the same boat.

Brian Schulmeister 56:36
Yeah, something crazy on the internet. Imagine that.

Jason DeFillippo 56:39
It's weird. Seriously, I thought this one over the virgin I kind of like this one in Chrome for iOS will soon keep incognito tabs even more secret with face ID. This is so if you have you know, your your phone's unlocked. You still have incognito mode open with your you know, I'd say Yeah, probably Pornhub tabs open. Just I'm just throwing

Brian Schulmeister 57:04
shame anymore for looking at Pornhub is are people really using incognito mode at this point? Or just just saying To hell with it?

Jason DeFillippo 57:12
I am guessing they probably do just to keep the Wi Fi, you know, away from it. So there's no history and your browser history? Yes, that would just be that's, that's literally the least you can do. cover your tracks. Right? But, or even if you're logged into like, say, your your company's VPN and you're looking at spreadsheets on your phone for you know, the projections for next year's grand takeover, and you want to keep it secret, to be able to lock that tab with some kind of, you know, extra security, I think is actually kind of a good thing. Just but the thing is nowadays, it's like, okay, your phones open already with face ID. Why do you need it again? Is this one of those, like scenarios where, okay, I unlocked my phone, I'm in Chrome, and I hand it to someone else with it unlocked. And then they start poking around. And then you get to that next level security security is like, I like the idea. But it seems like a pretty big edge case.

Dave Bittner 58:12
I think Well, I mean, signal works this way, right? Where you can have face ID a separate a separate layer of face ID for the signal app. And I think that's good functionality there as well. You know, it's, it allows you to have different tiers of access to your device. You know, you could say to your boss or to your spouse, or you know, whatever a significant other a trusted friend, you could say, here's the unlock code for my phone in case something happens to me. But you could still have some things that have a different degree of security on them that you don't provide access to. And why not?

Jason DeFillippo 58:53
Yeah, I guess. Yeah. I mean, why not? I like the idea. When I first heard it. I was just trying to break it down and see if it was actually useful as we were talking, you know, let's try and do a live, you know, devil's advocate, but I think yeah, it's probably pretty good.

Dave Bittner 59:05
I think it is, I wish I wish more apps that were security focused included that functionality to give you a granularity to the amount of access you want to have on a per app basis. I think there's some good usefulness there. I like the idea of it. It's good in signals so why not?

Brian Schulmeister 59:26
All right. And a couple of listeners sent us this link. I was actually I saw it as well and I thought it was kind of funny but wasn't gonna put it in the notes, but since we got some people sending it to us, here it is. This is over advice is this Beverly Hills Cop playing sublime Santeria to avoid being live streamed. Now first off, it's absolutely criminal that they were not playing Axel f by Harold falta Meyer Beverly Hills.

So very poor choice. I mean, they should have that just ready to play. Notice, here's the story last Friday, a man entered the Beverly Hills Police Department only to be treated to a mini DJ set that could potentially get his Instagram account banned. So senate des Vermont was at the department to file a form to obtain body camera footage from an incident in which he received a ticket he felt was unfair. Now, Deborah bond also happens to be a well known LA area activist who regularly livestreams protests and interactions with the police to is more than 300,000 followers on Instagram. So this guy is on the police's radar, he's a pain in the ass he is a gadfly to them. So I am wondering whether you know they have this music system ready to go for just anybody or if this is very special treatment for Mr. Government. So the idea here, of course, being if they start playing copyrighted material while they're being recorded, and it goes up, then obviously the streaming services, machine learning systems will copyright systems will grab it and immediately shut them down. Now the problem here is of course, they didn't do that. They don't seem to work. And all these videos are still up. so clever idea, though. I will give the Beverly Hills police a thumbs up on being clever enough to give that a go. Mm hmm. Yeah.

Dave Bittner 1:01:13
Yeah, there was another week, Ben and I covered this over on caveat this week. And there was another case where a different police officer I think, with a different person started playing some Beatles songs because the Beatles are famously. Particularly when it comes to having

Jason DeFillippo 1:01:31

Dave Bittner 1:01:33
Yes, that is the word I was looking for. Yes. And but you're right, it didn't work. I also give the police points for trying to be clever, you know, seems to me to be kind of, uh, not kind of seems to me to totally be a dick move on the cops part. Yeah. You know, I mean, they're they're they're allowed to be videotaped while they're working. So, you know, yeah. And my recollection, too, is that the police department was in Beverly Hills, right. This Police Department said they're reviewing the policy. So it sounds like they're probably going to get a slap on the wrist and say, knock it off.

Brian Schulmeister 1:02:12
Now, is there a distinction? I understand they're, they're allowed to be recorded while they're working. Is there a distinction between actually in the police station versus just out in public? Because he did go into the police station itself to start recording these guys? Huh. Good, because

Dave Bittner 1:02:28
then I would imagine, yeah, I would imagine that the public areas of the police station like the lobby would be fair game. You can bet that there's lots of recording devices already in that lobby. Yes. I would think yeah, I mean, if your back in in the working areas of the police station, they could make a case that that could be off limits, and I could I that seems reasonable to me, but in the public areas. I don't I don't see why they would. Why they feel like they need to shut that down. I mean, it Yes. It's a pain in the ass and it makes it who likes that to happen to have someone come in? Holding a video camera pointing it at you? It just it makes you uncomfortable. But if you're a cop, that's part of the job now.

Brian Schulmeister 1:03:14
Yeah, true.

Jason DeFillippo 1:03:16
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But the actual actual thing. Yeah.

Brian Schulmeister 1:03:24
I mean, I get goodwill from it. I think people would get a really good chuckle out of that and be like, ah, very clever, sir.

Know, it's gonna totally fly over like half. They've never seen a movie. Never heard of it. Yeah.

Jason DeFillippo 1:03:44
I tell you what, though. It does have legs. So worth worth the rewatch.

Dave Bittner 1:03:49
You know, this weekend. I watched coming to America with my son with my 14 year old jack Hmm. Because the coming to America sequel is coming out very excited. I hadn't seen coming to America in a long time. Probably. I remember I did see it in the theaters. And I don't know that. I've seen it since I probably Wow, here's but let me tell you. I think it's 1988 that movie came out and let me tell you movies were paced a lot differently. Yes, they were they are today. I mean, this movie is no slow. Also. I am not a huge fan of the director of this film. JOHN Landis. Hmm, I think the way I describe it is I think john Landis is a bad director of good movies. Okay. I think that some of you know I mean, think about some movies. He's done The Blues Brothers great movie, Trading Places. Great movie, this movie great movie. You're not really selling him as a director yet.

Jason DeFillippo 1:04:58
You're done making your case yet here.

Dave Bittner 1:05:00
I think these movies are good in spite of him. I think his skills as a director, and there are things when you watch his movies for me anyway, when I see them I go, Landis, you know, like, the way that he shoots his movies the way he edits, his movies, the shot selection, the there's all sorts of things that are that are his movies that I think as a director are sloppy, I find him to be a very sloppy director. But in spite of that, I have to admit, the movies are great. So I know I'm contradicting myself here. Somebody else can kind of, you know, get the new ones that I'm going for here. But

Jason DeFillippo 1:05:40
yeah, this ties into something Brian and I were talking about earlier in the show where you can make a horrible website and a horrible product and yet still get a billion dollar valuation. So john Landis is the clubhouse so

Brian Schulmeister 1:05:54
there you go

Jason DeFillippo 1:05:55
for clubhouses, the john Landis of apps Yes,

Brian Schulmeister 1:05:57
there you go. Yeah, it makes sense.

Dave Bittner 1:05:59
I'd say my favorite thing that john Landis ever directed is thriller.

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:03
No, yes,

Dave Bittner 1:06:04
I think I think he actually I think that he did a really good job on

Jason DeFillippo 1:06:07
but cancelled. can't watch it anymore.

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:09
Well, that's me. I won't watch it anymore. I

Dave Bittner 1:06:12
can't watch thriller way.

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:13
I have Michael Jackson issues. Okay,

Dave Bittner 1:06:17
I thought you had something against zombies.

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:19
No, I love zombies.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:24
All right. Well, this

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:24
talk is totally fine. No reason to cancel them yet. Now, right. You know, they make Hitler jokes on Twitter.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:31
Yeah, yeah.

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:32
Yeah. All right. Well, the Royal penis is clean. There you go.

Jason DeFillippo 1:06:40
Oh, boy.

Okay, that's usually my line.

Brian Schulmeister 1:06:44
I don't know why but that scene sticks out more than anything else from coming to America. I always remember that line.

Dave Bittner 1:06:52
It was a good one. My attire jack noticed it That's for sure.

Jason DeFillippo 1:06:56
Okay, before we get into any more trouble that we get canceled, let's call it a day guy.

Dave Bittner 1:07:01
Fair enough. Fair enough.

Jason DeFillippo 1:07:06
I saw this and that was just a head scratcher Intel is mocking Apple with their new ad campaign saying that. Oh yeah, you have the new m one Mac but you can't do this. You can't do that. Oh yeah, you want to want to launch a rocket? Better get a PC you want to touch the screen? Better get a PC and all this other crap and I'm just like, just the desperation smell that's coming off Intel right now is just it's palpable.

Brian Schulmeister 1:07:32
Yeah, I just don't bad choice on a PR firm or an advertising agency. I think here. I don't we don't need Intel and Apple like attacking each other. Just tell me what your fucking product does. That's all I want you to do for your advertising. Thank you.

Jason DeFillippo 1:07:50
An apple is not attacking Intel. Apple's just moving on. They're like, you know, it's just not working out. It's not it's not you. It's me. Better now.

Brian Schulmeister 1:08:00
I don't need Twitter beefs has advertising.

Jason DeFillippo 1:08:02
No, seriously it's like okay, PCs are good for PCs I every computer I have here is Intel except one. So the way it is but don't get Don't be petty Intel. Don't be petty. Yes. Petty inside that's what and I found this one there is a crowdfunding campaign to set a send a flat earther to space.

Brian Schulmeister 1:08:24
Can't we just crowdfund hitting him over the head with a hammer?

Jason DeFillippo 1:08:27
I think that's going to be cheaper. And probably. Since the GoFundMe campaign has only raised 250 pounds out of 250,000 pound goal. He can afford a hammer he can get even get one of those Pentagon hammers, not much.

Brian Schulmeister 1:08:40
Yeah, I don't I don't agree with spending this much money on idiocy.

Jason DeFillippo 1:08:44
No, no, but it's still funny. It is funny. catechin gotta get on that

Unknown Speaker 1:08:50
feedback loop.

Jason DeFillippo 1:08:53
over at Patreon we've got no one knew people had Christmas, nobody on Patreon over at PayPal, we've got Natalie, Linda, Andrew, Raj, Logan, Patricia, and Nathaniel. Thank you so

Brian Schulmeister 1:09:04
much. over Twitter, ma 6502 writes in that's one strategy to control the narrative. And this is from axios. The new media mogul Andreessen Horowitz, one of Silicon Valley's most formidable venture capital firms, is doubling down on content, putting some tech media outlets on edge. a16z, a multi billion dollar firm that invests across industries, has announced in January that it's building a new and separate media property because everybody else does. Why not? Why the fuck not? Yes. So why it matters. They aren't interested in traditional journalism, but in an era where content and reach has power and wants to exert more influence over how people think about tech and business issues, so it's basically creating a propaganda house.

Jason DeFillippo 1:09:45
Yes. They have a stake in Yeah, they have a big stake in clubhouse

Brian Schulmeister 1:09:50
Yes. Hence the billion dollar valuation for something that can't even have a fucking site that works.

Jason DeFillippo 1:09:57
But Andreessen Horowitz is the big dog. You know, the been around forever. Yeah. Marc Andreessen the old days most, for most of the what was it was a

Brian Schulmeister 1:10:07
mosaic. Yes. That's a first.

Jason DeFillippo 1:10:09
Yes. Mark now it looks like a supervillain He kind of looks like what's his name from Daredevil. The Vincent. D'Onofrio care. Okay, kingpin, kingpin. That's it. Very scary. And of course, our rights in this story could be titled under What could possibly go wrong. Those crazy Russkies are about to add the third dimension of traffic flying taxis to hit the skies in 2024.

Brian Schulmeister 1:10:36
Yeah, I'm gonna actually file this one under will have self driving cars and 510 20 years. Yeah, but hey, good. Some of these startups are getting a billion dollars in funding and yeah, that's the only trickle down economic economics that ever seem to work. So none of this shit is ever gonna happen.

Jason DeFillippo 1:10:53
ever go flying taxis could hit the ground in 2020.

Brian Schulmeister 1:10:57
Yeah, Matt writes in if Apple gets into some sort of crypto, it should be the apple seed. Then you can buy new laptop with apple seeds to corny.

Jason DeFillippo 1:11:06
Yes. And Sherman writes in what up geeks I thought you might get a kick out of this just more proof that the only way to get a company to do anything good for consumers is to shame them into it. This is at&t scrambles to install fiber for 90 year old after his viral Wall Street Journal ad. I saw this thing happen in real time and I'm like, I was just pissed off. I'm like, Okay, so this guy's got money. He can take out a Wall Street Journal ad and then he gets fiber but everybody else in North Hollywood is still stuck with crappy internet.

Brian Schulmeister 1:11:38
I know like 90 year old Aaron Epstein stop showing off with your $10,000 print ads just tweet him like everybody else does.

Jason DeFillippo 1:11:46
Exactly. fucker. Of course.

Brian Schulmeister 1:11:49
He actually got a result. Yeah,

Jason DeFillippo 1:11:52
he's gonna cost me $10,000 to take out an ad against Oculus just so I can get my $150 for the content back

Brian Schulmeister 1:11:58
Yeah, that's the way it works. You got to spend money to lose money. Jennifer writes in stolen Tesla totaled in downtown streets the owner was interviewed his description of the outcome truer words could not be said about the guy who stole it. Watch the interview goes into tech stuff about Tesla. And this is a link over from the Wb website stolen Tesla totaled and downtown during high speed joy, right? I watched the video and I didn't really see anything about getting into the Tesla stuff. So I don't know. Okay. I

Jason DeFillippo 1:12:29
don't know was I'm glad you watched it. I didn't. I read the article. And I'm like, Oh, you gotta make me watch something.

Brian Schulmeister 1:12:34
I know. I hate that. Okay for everything.

Jason DeFillippo 1:12:38
Yeah. Speaking of Vincent's back video sometimes

Brian Schulmeister 1:12:42
when I see Vincent's emails come in. I feel like we've been emailed by by by Burroughs himself.

Jason DeFillippo 1:12:53
Vincent, if you could, if you could siphon off a little more of that whiskey fund over to maybe our Patreon would be appreciated because your whiskey fund is is is epic, my man.

Brian Schulmeister 1:13:06
You know what we're doing on our podcast now, actually, Jason, when we go into the feedback section, we're playing Vincent roulette.

Unknown Speaker 1:13:12
Who's gonna get

Brian Schulmeister 1:13:15
this time? It's you.

Jason DeFillippo 1:13:17
Okay. Yeah, that's it. So we got a couple a couple here from Vincent about how the red envelope works on a year. Yes, and all of that. So here's the thing all of these are gonna be in the show notes. We're not cutting Vincent off he's not getting cut off here. But since there are so many of them, there's so many words we are going to save you the hour it would take to read them so yes, we've got a couple of good videos about Chinese New Year here and then he's got another one that apparently all the COVID in the world fits in a can and this one was kind of interesting that when you take in take into account how many people have been infected and what the size of the actual virus is and how teeny weeny tiny it is it can all fit in the can of coke All right, so that's pretty good new coke and Yep, new variant and

Brian Schulmeister 1:14:11
infecting me like I'm just reading him and I'm turning into him here.

Jason DeFillippo 1:14:17
And some Pornhub news apparently one of the big guys Grant Thornton is leaving Pornhub because they're being audited and Yep, these out. So there it is.

Brian Schulmeister 1:14:32
I think you get them from now on you do much better. I actually tried to go through and read it and then I start to like lose track of my mind completely. It's awesome.

Jason DeFillippo 1:14:41
Thank you when you get down to that.

Brian Schulmeister 1:14:44
Chris writes I love the show gems check out the head on HBO max it's six episode miniseries set in Antarctica binge it over the weekend and love that it was more mystery like the movie white out than a sci fi fest like the thing stay grumpy.

Jason DeFillippo 1:14:56
I'm three episodes into it and I'm thoroughly enjoying it and speaking Things that move very slowly. This moves very slowly. But I do enjoy it. There is a good call out to the thing in the actual movie itself. So it's pretty funny. Cool. Highlander writes in in light of what's gone on in Washington last month. I thought this song is really meaningful. cyberpunks Leakey mix, and this is from partition 30 or partition 36, the optic nerve. So that link will be in the show notes. He says, Thanks, geeks great show. Well, thank you very much Islander.

Brian Schulmeister 1:15:27
Thank you. And Jake from State Farm writes in Hey grumps, nobody gets the Jake from State Farm joke.

Jason DeFillippo 1:15:33
Everybody gets the Jake from State Farm joke I just

Brian Schulmeister 1:15:36
saw you were talking about Pornhub verification and there's a strong incentive behind it. If they allowed people to upload porn that had children under 18 and did nothing about it. They could be complicit in distribution of child sexual abuse material, the term replacing child porn. This carries a mandatory minimum of five years in federal prison. On a separate note, law enforcement and lawmakers are going away from saying the term child pornography for a good reason the word pornography implies consent whereas no miner is legally able to give consent for this hence why it is now called child sexual abuse material. CSA m it's wordy, but it makes a lot of sense. We have a link in the show notes from there. I hope you guys are doing well. All right, yeah, obviously that's a huge issue and part of the reason but the article that we were specifically criticizing last week regarding Pornhub attempting to use biometrics for user verification rather than basics like needing to have a company or social security number in order to get paid which also provides basic verifications and age Yes, we get we get why they're doing it. It's just why I use biometrics.

Jason DeFillippo 1:16:34
Yes, exactly. And the other thing is guys guys guys get a branding company. Get a branding company child sexual abuse material. Come on child porn rolls off the tongue child sexual abuse material does not your turning into the LGBTQ lb f plus they actually have like, you know punctuation in the name now Come on, everybody needs to get a better PR company all I know.

Brian Schulmeister 1:16:59
I need to isolate you saying child pornography rolls off the tongue that might be the most fucked up phrase you've ever said.

That doesn't make sense that is not in the end clip on this show. I'm gonna be so pissed off at you because if I would have said it you would have fucking done it to me.

Jason DeFillippo 1:17:26
That's that's the the plus you have. Anyway, moving on. canceled canceled in overnight iTunes. We got a couple five stars. Whoo. Doctors are jersey jersey gave us a five star from the UK it says they will read your review in the show even if it's one star but I find that five stars are more appropriate for them with a I can't even see the emoji. But there's an emoji there some sort of Thank you. Yes. Thank you guys. Thank you, Jersey.

Brian Schulmeister 1:17:56
Nick Dawson gave us a five star review as well says what a great show. I've been listening for the past two years and I love it. There's something for everyone. They bring great news and they discuss the audio quality and production value is outstanding. I do not know how anybody could give less than a five star review.

Jason DeFillippo 1:18:10
I agree. All right. And we've got a Chazz Trish review it says perfect in in parentheses, almost a five star takes all the boxes discussed right on point sarcasm not nearly enough. Yeah, right. Politics piss off if your views don't match my own tech enough to keep the title. Security news is the most helpful, especially when giving Mac OS upgrade advice right Dave? Thanks for leaves these. Thankfully, these dummies match by innate bias, which is all that's important in news these days. Am I right?

Brian Schulmeister 1:18:45
Well, the key event my innate bias. Okay, yeah. If you want your question or comment right on the show, head over to Gog dot show slash contact and send us your feedback or questions that we can read on the air. And if you're so inclined, please head over to Gog dot show slash review, and toss us a five star and snarky review.

Jason DeFillippo 1:19:03
And if you're still listening on the overcast player, click those little stars please pretty please.

Brian Schulmeister 1:19:12
Speaking of production values, we lost one of the greats in audio engineering and music mixing console pioneer Rupert Neve has passed away at 94 years old. He basically invented the Neve 8028 mixing console, which was integral to the classic rock sound of the 70s. He made all kinds of stuff basically everybody that's ever done anything loves Neve consoles, loves Neve electronics. It's the best sound of all, especially at the iconic la recording facilities, Sound City studios, of which you've probably seen the documentary. We've reviewed it on here and said it was great. So yeah, absolutely fantastic stuff so he shall be missed.

Jason DeFillippo 1:19:49
I've used some of his plugins. Actually,

Brian Schulmeister 1:19:51
plugins are very good to do. Yeah,

Jason DeFillippo 1:19:53
man, they really beautiful. Until next time, I'm Jason DeFillippo.

Brian Schulmeister 1:19:57
And I'm Brian Schulmeister. Thanks for listening to grumpy geeks The show is a labor of love but your support keeps the show going. If you like the show, please visit Gog dot show slash donate to help us out. We'll love you forever or visit Gog dot show slash shop and pick up some good old fashioned Gog swag. They can't do that then please pass the show along to a friend word of mouth is the only way the show grows. So spread the grump far and wide Show Notes for this episode are a Gog dot show slash 495. From there you can find links to old episodes leave feedback, ask questions, donate to the show, buy our swag and get links to stuff we like stay grumpy

Jason DeFillippo 1:20:31
child porn rolls off the tongue

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